Buick Sound Advice

"MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner" (montegoman562) 04/12/2016 at 12:15 • Filed to: None

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Hey guys, a buddy of mine at work has a 2000 Buick Century with the Concert Sound III. So he had a local car audio place put in a new head unit (kenwood) and new rear 6x9 speakers (they’re pretty solid 6x9's Pioneers) and well...it sounds like shit. No taking it back to them isn’t an option because he sat on it for over a year without complaining to them, he just thought the speakers sucked and he made a poor purchase.

I believe theres an inline amplifier in the Concert Sound III, should we try and run wire direct to his upgraded Kenwood head unit, try and upgrade the inline amp?

Thoughts?

Thanks guys

UPDATE: I went out and looked in the trunk, the audio place sliced 4 wires off the amp and they aren’t capped and don’t lead anywhere. It was also 6 months ago not a year so he’s bringing it back to them and saying what the hell guys? I mean, I don’t have anything to test with, for all we know there’s 4 live wires in his trunk he’s been riding around with, they don’t match the speaker wire so I don’t even know if they are power.

I’ll let you guys know as the story continues...

yitznewton > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/12/2016 at 12:21

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I have zero GM audio experience, but my VW had the “premium” audio option, which meant it was a bizarre and one-off wiring/amp setup. The head unit outputs were specifically designed for that amp, and no off-the-shelf head unit would be compatible. Maybe he’s got something like that, and the local place are idiots or crooks and didn’t set him up right.

I just jumpered the existing HU-amp wires to the amp-speaker wires, and ran the new HU speaker-outs. So:

New HU speaker output  amp wiring  speaker wiring  new speakers

misfitmascots > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/12/2016 at 12:24

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You’re either going to have to go straight to the head unit or get an external amp. There is probably a factory amplifier that isn’t strong enough to power the pioneers, hence they sound shitty.

Nibbles > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/12/2016 at 13:08

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If the original amp is in use, bypass it. It utilizes a specific signal from the OEM head unit to function properly - most people, if they want to retain it, relocate the OEM head unit to somewhere inconspicuous and wire the new unit in parallel so the amp can work.

Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/12/2016 at 13:11

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I’ve never heard of any variation of the Concert Sound or any Buick having an amp that isn’t inside the head unit. My Riviera has Concert Sound II (which is honestly a meaningless designation as it is totally different than the CSII in the Murdersofa) and it’s just a bog-standard GM head unit going to some speakers. I think the “concert sound” part is the fact it has tweeters making is 6 speakers instead of 4. I utilized all of the factory wiring when putting in my aftermarket stuff, it should just be straight speaker wire from the head unit back to the 6x9s and to the door speakers. Personally I’d try dicking around with the equalizer and such in the HU.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Nibbles 04/12/2016 at 13:13

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Fascinating!

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To 04/12/2016 at 13:14

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I literally touched the amp in the trunk, it’s mounted in between the 2 rear deck speakers. It’s CSIII not CSII and apparently has 9 speakers.

Nibbles > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/12/2016 at 13:15

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Agitating!

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Nibbles 04/12/2016 at 13:16

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INDEED

but not so much to me as it isn’t my car

Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/12/2016 at 14:57

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Damn Buick calling different shit the same name. The CSIII in a later Park Ave (?)is the exact same as the CSII in my Riv.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To 04/12/2016 at 14:58

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Fantastic. Good work GM/Buick. Thanks for making all of this complicated for absolutely no reason. Proprietary signals to and from an amp/head unit is fucking idiotic to begin with.

Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/12/2016 at 15:00

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It’s likely the same system used in the Oldsmobile Aurora and Cadillac Seville which both had trunk-mounted amps. If you can’t find info/pinouts on your specific system you might try searching for info pertaining to those models.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To 04/12/2016 at 15:01

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oooo good tip thanks

Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/12/2016 at 15:57

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Grain of salt. I never cared enough about the stock sound systems to look closely at them, but I know the Seville and the Olds had amps, and it would make sense GM would share components. Because GM

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To 04/12/2016 at 16:05

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Haha, at the same time it would be 100% GM to use completely different components.

jimz > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/18/2016 at 12:23

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most cheap- to mid-priced aftermarket speakers are shit. they’re as bad as most OEM speakers in terms of performance and all the sparkly cones and cast frames won’t change that.

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > jimz 04/18/2016 at 12:26

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these are being screwed with by this built in factory amplifier. I’ve heard back from others that the amp was only built to interact with the original head unit, now that that’s gone it doesn’t know what it’s doing.

The amp is also taking over power delivery instead of it coming from the head unit. the amp has about 135 watts TOTAL to distribute to 8 speakers. These new speakers are designed to take around 200 per speaker 135 divided by 8 = 16.875 isn’t going to push these speakers much

jimz > MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner 04/18/2016 at 13:18

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now that that’s gone it doesn’t know what it’s doing.

That’s nonsense. Amplifiers are more or less simple voltage sources; assuming there’s no DSP in them the only thing they “know” is if the speaker’s impedance is too low. then they might overheat or trigger over-current protection (if present.) the only place you tend to get into trouble is if the audio signal from the OE head unit is differential (balanced) and the amplifier’s input is single-ended (unbalanced.) in that case you’re shorting one of the audio input wires to ground and the head unit can freak out.

These new speakers are designed to take around 200 per speaker

The biggest pile of horseshit in the audio industry is power “ratings” for aftermarket car speakers. a typical 6x9 is going to have a 25 or 30mm voice coil which is simply not going to be able to dissipate 200 watts without burning up. something that size just can’t get rid of the heat fast enough. Unless the manufacturer tells you exactly how they determined the speaker’s power handling, the number on the box is pretty much worthless.

I’ve worked for two of the better known car audio manufacturers. I’ve been in OE car audio for a long time. when it comes to speakers I’ve seen piles and piles of crap (both OE and aftermarket) and very little which I would consider “good.”

MontegoMan562 is a Capri RS Owner > jimz 04/18/2016 at 13:48

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Well I’ll be sure to update you with what happens after he eventually takes it back to the car audio place.

He bought these speakers:

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-h2IO7T9X7DQ/…

So I was off on the specs when i was remembering to last week. It’s not like his head unit is going to put 200 to each speaker anyhow.

But it’s not like he bought crap off brand speakers, they should be pretty solid. I’ve had great luck with pioneer in the past.

Scottie > Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To 07/24/2017 at 14:26

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I have concert sound 3 in my park ave. It is a 9 speaker system. There is an amp(with built in crossover) in the trunk drivers side, just below the rear deck 6x9. I currently have my factory amp’s bass channel bridged and running 4ohm mono with 2 radio shack 12" 8ohm subs in a large sealed box.

So....yes there are LOTS of buicks with separate amplifiers.

Scottie > Jake - Has Bad Luck So You Don't Have To 07/24/2017 at 14:28

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Completely different system, man. the park ave ultra has a delco amp in the trunk. There are 2 major variations concert sound III. One in cars with U69 code, and one for U99.